Royal Commission report day 19 page 24
The Royal Commission evidence for 13/5/1881
(see also introduction to day 19)
Sgt Whelan giving evidence
6494 Daily, nearly?— Whenever there was a party in, they were practising with guns and revolvers, in the little paddock we had rented near the station, and it was found the Martinis used to carry too far.
6495 Were they not practising constantly with the arms they had to use?— A good deal.
6496 Were they proficient in the use of their arms?— Yes.
6497 Mr. Nicolson says that when he returned the second time, he found some of the men unaccustomed to the use of arms; do you know who they were?— No; there was never a mistake with the arms, though they used to have to turn out silently and hurriedly at night, excepting that once of Keen’s,
6498 You did not attribute that to the want of knowledge of the arms?— No, because in loading his “Spencer” he put those cartridges in the magazine, and it appears you raise a spring which is the trigger-guard as well, and he did so, and looked into the barrel, and would see no cartridge, for except you look while it is being shut down you would think the weapon is unloaded,—as you eject one cartridge shell it throw” the nest one into the barrel.
6499 By the Commission. —Could it come about by inadvertence?— It is a thing a man should never do to present his weapon at another, even though a man understood the arms. If a man looked into the barrel, except he watched in closely, the ball would go in in shutting it down without his seeing it.
6500 By Mr. Hare. —You had a great knowledge of everything during the time the officers were at Benalla;—I mean while Captain Standish, myself, Mr. O'Connor and Mr. Sadleir were there. Did you see any jealousy arising out of anything here between the officers?— No; I daily saw you, and every night at the telegraph office,—sometimes up to 12 o'clock at night, to get orders.
6501 Did you see any altercations between officers?— No; I thought you were the best of friends.
6502 Do you think we threw away any chances through jealousy?— I would be inclined to say positively that was not true.
6503 And you had a thorough knowledge of the parties and of the orders given through you?— Yes.
6504 By the Commission. —Would you say that on behalf of any officers?— I would say that the officers were all on the best of terms. They were always together. The three used to come up to the office on the wettest of nights; they used to come there, and I had to go there to receive orders.
6505 The public service did not suffer by any misunderstanding between the officers?— Certainly not.
6506 Did you see any?— No.
6507 Would that apply to the whole time Mr. O'Connor was there?— Yes. I never saw any disagreement there or apparently after Mr. Hare came back in June 1880. Mr. O'Connor used to come; with him to the post-office at night.
6508 By Mr. Hare. —You spoke about the black?— You thought they were too large a number to work in the mountains. Have you had much experience in the mountain work?— I have not been out,
6509 Had you a knowledge of them?— Yes.
6510 Do you think the blacks, as worked in a body, would ever catch the Kellys?— Not with a party of nineteen horses, as I have said before.
6511 The last time they went out, what number had they going up to Beechworth?— The order was not to be less than six men.
6512 How many horses went on that occasion—the last troop that Mr. O'Connor and Mr. Nicolson went out with?—I cannot tell from memory now. Six troopers, because, if they came in contact with those offenders it was necessary to have men to fight.
6513 What do you think the best way to work the blacks according to your experience; in a body of six, or a couple of blacks with a party of police?— I should send only two, the same as I had when I followed Power and got Mr. McBean's mare.
6514: Do you know whether that is the practice in New South Wales ?— No, I do not.
6515 Do you see any necessity for six going out?— I think it is too many.
6516 Do you not think it would be better to have two at the different stations—Beechworth, Wangaratta, and here, if you had a party to go with them?— I think it is better to have them together. It is easy to send them by railway as quick as they are required at any time.
6517 Would it not be known then?— No; you can send them away without notice being taken of them—they are frequently travelling on the line; because one man can take charge of them, and if you separate them it would take three constables.
6518 By the Commission. —Were you aware that Mr. O'Connor objected to such a number of Victorian police going out?— I heard it in the evidence.
6519 Suppose they had not gone, would the black trackers have been fit to cope with the outlaws?— I think they would have had a very poor chance.....
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