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04:03, 15 November 2015 Story of the KellyGang - the Royal Commission evidence
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== The Royal Commission evidence for 7/4/1881 ==
''''''
=== full text ===
(see also introduction to [[Royal Commission report 7/4/1881|day 10]])
'''Sup [[Sadleir|John Sadleir]] giving evidence'''
<span id="rc1831">[[#rc1831|1831]]</span> Not more than forty?— I do not think more than forty. I am merely guessing roughly after this lapse of time. I remember seeing several diggers. After we camped at Mrs. [[Mrs Margaret Byrne|Byrne]]'s house we saw the game was up, and she and her children were about; and the diggers and different people about came down, seeing the crowd of men, and sat down, some of them amongst the police.
<span id="rc1832">[[#rc1832|1832]]</span> Was the arrangement with [[Aaron Sherritt|Sherritt]] made before the general outside public were present or after?— Well, upon my word, I cannot tell you that. It was made the moment as soon as I heard who he was.
<span id="rc1833">[[#rc1833|1833]]</span> About what time did you arrive at Sherritt's hut?— I would have to look and see what hour daylight was on that day. The sun had not risen though there was an early dawn.
<span id="rc1834">[[#rc1834|1834]]</span> Then in all probability the arrangement made with Aaron Sherritt was made before seven in the morning?— I fancy that it would be before that.
<span id="rc1835">[[#rc1835|1835]]</span> Had the general public arrived before that?— The “general public” would include two women and children and perhaps three or four men.
1836 Would they be all?— I think they would be.
<span id="rc1837">[[#rc1837|1837]]</span> A portion of the Byrne family would have been likely to have been amongst the spectators when you were talking to Aaron Sherritt?— It is likely they may have observed him; they were observing what the men were doing. I do not suppose Mrs. Byrne knew Captain Standish from any of the other officers.
<span id="rc1838">[[#rc1838|1838]]</span> She knew Aaron Sherritt?— Yes; but he was not the only man spoken to by the police. Aaron Sherritt was not seen till we got to Mrs. Byrne's.
<span id="rc1839">[[#rc1839|1839]]</span> Were there any of the public present except the police at the time when Captain Standish and Mr. Nicolson and yourself were in conversation with Aaron Sherritt?— Mrs. Byrne.
1840 And who else did you see?— Some reporters and some diggers.
<span id="rc1841">[[#rc1841|1841]]</span> Would this arrangement made with Aaron Sherritt be known to the public, that is, Mrs. Byrne and the miners who were there?— No. How could they, unless they had ears to hear a long way off?— Certainly not.
1842 Did you or Captain Standish to your knowledge endeavor to make any arrangement with any other individual except Aaron Sherritt?— Yes.
<span id="rc1843">[[#rc1843|1843]]</span> Would it be a breach of faith to mention it?— No; I am at liberty to do so. We tried Mrs. Byrne. Whether I was the principal speaker or not, I was there when it was done. We pointed out to her that here her son had got his neck into a halter, and that she could save him if she liked; and her answer was “He has made his own bed, let him lie on it;” and there was a good deal of persuasion of that sort used with her.
1844 Were there any of the diggers about?— I do not think so; but I would have spoken to her in that way before fifty people.
1845 Because you knew she was the mother of Byrne?— Yes; and I tried to work on her mother's feelings.
1846 Would you have spoken so to an, other person not connected with Byrne “before fifty people”?— No; certainly not.
1847 They were not outlaws then?— No; they were not proclaimed. That was not, I think, until December.
<span id="rc1848">[[#rc1848|1848]]</span> Since you have given part of the arrangements entered into with this man Sherritt, I would like to know the remainder?— The substance of the understanding was this: it was proposed that he should have an understanding that Captain Standish would recommend to the Government that Joe Byrne's life should be saved, not his liberty, and that he should be tempted through Aaron Sherritt to lead the police on to the other three.
<span id="rc1849">[[#rc1849|1849]]</span> What were the terms?— Only Joe Byrne's life.
<span id="rc1850">[[#rc1850|1850]]</span> Was there no agreement made as to his reward and so forth?— I cannot say. Of course if there was any reward out he would have got it. I believe there was at the time.
<span id="rc1851">[[#rc1851|1851]]</span> Was Sherritt to be engaged as the servant of the police at any stipulated pay?— No, not at that time; I do not think he had a farthing from us at that time.
<span id="rc1852">[[#rc1852|1852]]</span> Will you go on with your narrative?— Yes. There was information coming in about that time of such a confused sort that my papers would show that it was impossible to make anything of it. I see—[''looking at a paper'']—that we had had information that the Kellys were seen about that time at Kerang, near [[Echuca|Echuca]]; that they were seen near Gaffney's Creek; that they were seen on the [[Strathbogie Ranges|Strathbogie]]; that they were seen at [[Oxley|Oxley]], [[Myrtleford|Myrtleford]], [[Hedi|Hedi]]; and it is impossible to say where not......
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