Royal Commission report day 24 page 16
The Royal Commission evidence for 1/6/1881
(see also introduction to day 24)
Const James Dwyer giving evidence
9514 It appears that Senior-Constable Kelly, in his sworn evidence at Beechworth, stated that you had kicked Ned Kelly when he was down, and I find here in Mr. Sadleir's report that you acknowledge you did so. “It will be seen from the evidence of Senior-Constable Kelly, 1925, in the examination of the prisoner Edward Kelly, before the Beechworth police court, that Constable Dwyer, 2507, kicked the prisoner when already secured by the other police. I may state that Constable Dwyer reported the circumstance to me himself, immediately after the occurrence, and expressed his regret that in the excitement of the moment he so far forgot himself”?— Yes, I told Mr. Sadleir so.
9515 When you came down and told about the capture, you said you gave Kelly a kick?— Yes, I did.
9516 The question is this: was the kick given from vindictive feelings or disgust at his cowardice?— Disgust at his cowardice, having heard his friends say he would never be taken alive, and then hearing him call out what he did, it roused my indignation against him, as I have already said. The prisoners came out at ten minutes past ten. I was then at the railway station, eating a bit of dry bread and cheese on the platform, when I saw them rush out of the front with their hands up, crying out, “We are all innocent people; we are innocent–we are prisoners.”
9517 That was the men prisoners?— Yes, I ran up, and Mr. Melvin, of the Argus, the other civilians, and Mr. McWhirter. I ran into the crowd of prisoners as they rushed out. I had my gun ready, looking amongst them for the outlaws. I was under the impression that the outlaws had surrendered then themselves. Reardon was near me at the time. Not seeing the outlaws, I said to Reardon, “Where is the outlaws?” “They are in there, sir,” he answered, pointing with his finger to the window of the house.
9518 To the room they were in?— Yes. The two were standing at the window, and going back and forwards, like this, to get an open to fire with his gun, like this–[explaining his meaning by gesture]. Mr. Melvin, of the Argus, came up and laid his hand upon my shoulder, and I said, “Go back; do you see them inside going to fire out.” He did do so, and went back to a tree, and I went back with him. I was impressed then, that if I kept with the civilians, they would not fire at me; and I kept Reardon and the others close to me until I got to the north of the house. I was in plain clothes at the time. I took shelter behind a tree. I saw them then peeping out, going to the side of the window to look out. I saw a helmet on his head, and walking back and up the passage. I saw one get out from the dwelling-house to the back kitchen; and I ran round to the north side, thinking I might get a shot at him there. A second one came after him, and went into the kitchen too; and the thought struck me to go down to the railway station, to put on Ned Kelly's armour. I did not tell anyone of it then that I would do so. I ran down to do so; and when I went to the railway station, Mr. Craven, of the Commercial hotel, Benalla, and Mr. Ball, and Mr. Shortell, and other civilians, they were looking at it; and Mr. Craven had the helmet of Ned Kelly fitting it on. Seeing me they spoke in a friendly way, and, talking about the armour, I said, “That is the very thing I came down for. I want to put it on and rush the house, and then the other men could come to my assistance.” One of those men–I do not know which–expressed, “It is a good idea, but perhaps it would be better not to go. You might get shot in the encounter.”
9519 Did you see Mr. Sadleir?— Not at that time.
9520 Did you suggest that to Mr. Sadleir?— No; the armour was so cumbersome and so heavy that I abandoned that idea and went back.
9521 Did you put it on?— Yes, some of it. I took the helmet from Mr. Craven–he had not the breast-plate and the rest of it; and when I took this breast-plate, I found it so heavy I thought I would do better without it, and rush. I went back again to the same place I left, and I heard Constable Armstrong, and saw him coming up to Mr. Sadleir. Mr. Sadleir and Mr. O'Connor were at this time walking round the lines.
9522 What did you hear Armstrong say?— I did not hear him say, but he himself told me after, that he had volunteered to rush the house.
9523 Did you volunteer to Mr. Sadleir to rush it?— Yes.
9524 When?— At half-past two.
9525 What did you say?— “Mr. Sadleir, there are four of us down behind the tree, Armstrong, Dixon, Montford, and I, willing to rush the house, if you will let us, and put an end to this suspense.” “Indeed I will not,” he said, “I will not sanction any man to lose his life, and you should not ask me; and you should not leave where you were. Go back and stop there.” I went back again to the constables. We were then within about twenty or twenty-five yards of the house, and Armstrong said, “What did he say?” and I told him that he would not allow it. Montfort said, “Well, I will go and ask him;” and he did, and he told him the same words.....
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