Royal Commission report day 31 page 4
The Royal Commission evidence for 16/6/1881
(see also introduction to day 31)
Sup John Sadleir giving evidence
11926 Did we not get on the track of men that answered the description of the outlaws?— We thought we were on the track of the outlaws at the time, I know.
11927 And they were quite fresh?— Yes.
11928 Do you remember the occasion that Mr. Hare and I referred to about the boy Moses tracking?— I was not with you then.
11929 Do you remember the occasion?— I am not quite sure.
11930 Do you remember the time Mr. Hare was out and came with this boy Moses, when be came in and reported about the rapidity with which this boy tracked?— Yes, I remember that being talked about, but I was not there to see for myself.
11931 Do you remember hearing Mr. Hare's opinion about the boy at the time, about his wonderful rapidity?— Yes, I remember that before that Mr. Hare had very little faith in the trackers, though he was one that sent for them first; but I understood, after that trip up that country, his opinion was changed— it was about Tom Lloyd's, some of the ranges about Greta thereabouts, as I believe.
11932 Then my statement in my evidence that Mr. Hare, after our first trip together, had such a good opinion of us that he said we should never go out unless upon sure information is correct?— Yes, I believe that was the occasion he said it, and I know it was about that time.
11933 In reference to the Lancefield bank robbery, will you state if Sub-Inspector Baber ever told you about it, and, if so, what did he say?— I cannot remember that he did.
11934 By the Commission— Before that I wish to ask you, in your opinion, would the trackers act as well in twos or threes as in larger numbers?— Not against armed men. I have given you a written statement on that; I endeavoured to make that plain.
11935 What we want to elicit is your opinion as to whether it would be wiser, as a matter of policy, to keep the black forces at one centre, or to have them in different portions of the colony; say, in the country where the outlaws were?— If it is a mere opinion, and a recommendation, considering all the present circumstances, I should advise, as long as there was any danger in that district, to leave them there in a body.
11936 Do you think, from what you have seen of the blacks, that it is better for general efficiency anywhere that six or seven be kept together, or that they be detached?— There is no object in keeping six together, except as they combined to search for the gang; for ordinary search work, such as tracking horse-stealing in the Wimmera, where you do not expect to find an armed man at the end of your work, they will do very well in twos. If they would go singly they would do equally well, but they get lonely singly; but for ordinary duty, suppose there was no probability of another armed gang being out, you can separate them as you please, so long as you keep them contented. That is my opinion.
11937 The next question is a question of policy, whether those men will work as well under officers that one or two may be under as they would work in a body under such an officer as Mr. O'Connor?— Oh, they would certainly work under an officer like Mr. O'Connor, who understands them, better under all circumstances, singly or six together, because they are full of tricks and they have to be watched. A person must be up to their dodges, and other men do not understand them. I am satisfied they do not. I am satisfied that where those trackers have failed, in ordinary peaceful duty so to speak, it has been through want of proper handling, not through any want of skill on their part. We had no benefit from the first trackers, because there were only two, and they anticipated danger if they thought they were on the tracks. I think they may he possibly kept in small detachments if the circumstances allow and if they are properly handled. We will say suppose those six; men that know each other begin to get lonely at Sandhurst or Wimmera, let them meet one another, change across; but in the face of armed resistance I would not trust two trackers, or three perhaps, or anything like a small number for a day.
11938 By Mr. O'Connor— Then you do not remember hearing Mr. Baber telling you about the Lancefield robbery, about the tracking?— I do not think I saw him after that for months, and I really forget if there was any conversation. If you recall any circumstances to my mind I may remember. He has spoken in a general way certainly, and he told me the tracks were picked up under various difficulties; rain, I think he said, was the principal one.
11939 What do you know yourself about the Lancefield bank robbery?— Nothing at all.
11940 You accompanied him to Kilmore?— Yes.
11941 Was it not raining heavily all that night?— Yes.
11942 The next morning we hade to go to pick up those tracks?— Yes.
11943 Did I ever refuse to let you have any or all my tackers when you asked me?— I never asked you for them.....
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