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Story of the KellyGang - the Royal Commission evidence
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== The Royal Commission evidence for 18/5/1881 ==
''''''
=== full text ===
(see also introduction to [[Royal Commission report 18/5/1881|day 22]])
'''SConst [[SConst John Kelly|Kelly]] giving evidence'''
<span id="rc8363">[[#rc8363|8363]]</span> Would it not be a much more dangerous place as being a challenge them than if the barracks were in an ordinary place?— Yes, I believe so.
<span id="rc8364">[[#rc8364|8364]]</span> At the [[Greta|Greta hotel]] would it not be possible for men to come in at the back door and front door up to any hour of the day or night when the public had a right to access to the licensed house?— Yes, at any time.
<span id="rc8365">[[#rc8365|8365]]</span> From your knowledge of the district do you think there is any place in the district where there are more ill-disposed people likely to assassinate you than in that district?— I believe it is the worst place in the colony.
<span id="rc8366">[[#rc8366|8366]]</span> I want to ascertain exactly the discipline of the police force and the feeling amongst the men — was there, to your knowledge, amongst the men a feeling that any officers (I do not particularize officers) would have a down upon and would not advance the prospects in the force of men who had been in Mr. [[Hare|Hare]]'s party at Glenrowan?— I believe there was an ill feeling against Mr. Hare's party with some of the men.
<span id="rc8367">[[#rc8367|8367]]</span> Which of the men did you say?— Against Mr. Hare's party of men — for his selecting all his own men.
<span id="rc8368">[[#rc8368|8368]]</span> Feeling on whose part?— Some of the other constables. They were Bourke men.
<span id="rc8369">[[#rc8369|8369]]</span> You say they were Bourke men principally in Mr. Hare's party?— Yes.
<span id="rc8370">[[#rc8370|8370]]</span> Did the same feeling exist amongst the officers; was it stated to exist amongst the officers?— I do not know.
<span id="rc8371">[[#rc8371|8371]]</span> You have no opinion upon that matter?— I have no opinion upon that matter.
<span id="rc8372">[[#rc8372|8372]]</span> Then if it is stated that there was ill feeling and that the men’s promotion would not be ensured that belonged to this particular party at Glenrowan, and that they would not be recommended for promotion, would that be true or false?— I cannot say.
<span id="rc8373">[[#rc8373|8373]]</span> Would it be true or false, in your opinion. The question I ask you is this: what did you, in your own mind, consider that order to Greta was for. Did you think it was to ensure your promotion or as a punishment?— Mr. [[Sadleir|Sadleir]] told me that he was going to get me advanced, and that by not going there I should lose all.
<span id="rc8374">[[#rc8374|8374]]</span> You got that notice?— He told me that repeatedly.
<span id="rc8375">[[#rc8375|8375]]</span> At what time?— I think it was in the stable one morning.
<span id="rc8376">[[#rc8376|8376]]</span> When?— Before I put that application in.
<span id="rc8377">[[#rc8377|8377]]</span> Are you advanced or put back in the service?— I am neither. I am in the same position.
<span id="rc8378">[[#rc8378|8378]]</span> You are a constable in charge of a district in the west?— At Terang.
<span id="rc8379">[[#rc8379|8379]]</span> Then you have not received any promotion for your service?— I have not.
<span id="rc8380">[[#rc8380|8380]]</span> In any way?— In any way.
<span id="rc8381">[[#rc8381|8381]]</span> And it would depend upon the officer recommending you there?— Yes, I think it would depend upon the officer.
<span id="rc8382">[[#rc8382|8382]]</span> You are in Mr. Chambers’s district now, are you?— Yes.
<span id="rc8383">[[#rc8383|8383]]</span> In order to ensure your promotion when you change your district, have you to make way, as it is called, make your character known to the new officer?— I suppose he will go by the record sheet.
<span id="rc8384">[[#rc8384|8384]]</span> Have you not, in going to a fresh district, to prove by your conduct that you are worthy?— You have.
<span id="rc8385">[[#rc8385|8385]]</span> And that puts a man back in the service?— No doubt.
<span id="rc8386">[[#rc8386|8386]]</span> Then with regard to changes, if a man is stationed in the country and he applies for a change, is it considered promotion or the reverse if he is sent down to the depot here?— If he applies for a change it would be at his own request he was sent down.
<span id="rc8387">[[#rc8387|8387]]</span> Supposing it is not at his own request he is transferred from the district, is it considered an advantageous station or the reverse to be sent from a country district down to the barracks?— They consider it a punishment, so I found.
<span id="rc8388">[[#rc8388|8388]]</span> Is that so looked upon in the service?— Yes.
<span id="rc8389">[[#rc8389|8389]]</span> It is not at all events a sign of promotion?— No.....
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[[Royal Commission report day 22 page 15|previous page]] / [[Royal Commission report day 22 page 17|next page]]
== The Royal Commission evidence for 18/5/1881 ==
''''''
=== full text ===
(see also introduction to [[Royal Commission report 18/5/1881|day 22]])
'''SConst [[SConst John Kelly|Kelly]] giving evidence'''
<span id="rc8363">[[#rc8363|8363]]</span> Would it not be a much more dangerous place as being a challenge them than if the barracks were in an ordinary place?— Yes, I believe so.
<span id="rc8364">[[#rc8364|8364]]</span> At the [[Greta|Greta hotel]] would it not be possible for men to come in at the back door and front door up to any hour of the day or night when the public had a right to access to the licensed house?— Yes, at any time.
<span id="rc8365">[[#rc8365|8365]]</span> From your knowledge of the district do you think there is any place in the district where there are more ill-disposed people likely to assassinate you than in that district?— I believe it is the worst place in the colony.
<span id="rc8366">[[#rc8366|8366]]</span> I want to ascertain exactly the discipline of the police force and the feeling amongst the men — was there, to your knowledge, amongst the men a feeling that any officers (I do not particularize officers) would have a down upon and would not advance the prospects in the force of men who had been in Mr. [[Hare|Hare]]'s party at Glenrowan?— I believe there was an ill feeling against Mr. Hare's party with some of the men.
<span id="rc8367">[[#rc8367|8367]]</span> Which of the men did you say?— Against Mr. Hare's party of men — for his selecting all his own men.
<span id="rc8368">[[#rc8368|8368]]</span> Feeling on whose part?— Some of the other constables. They were Bourke men.
<span id="rc8369">[[#rc8369|8369]]</span> You say they were Bourke men principally in Mr. Hare's party?— Yes.
<span id="rc8370">[[#rc8370|8370]]</span> Did the same feeling exist amongst the officers; was it stated to exist amongst the officers?— I do not know.
<span id="rc8371">[[#rc8371|8371]]</span> You have no opinion upon that matter?— I have no opinion upon that matter.
<span id="rc8372">[[#rc8372|8372]]</span> Then if it is stated that there was ill feeling and that the men’s promotion would not be ensured that belonged to this particular party at Glenrowan, and that they would not be recommended for promotion, would that be true or false?— I cannot say.
<span id="rc8373">[[#rc8373|8373]]</span> Would it be true or false, in your opinion. The question I ask you is this: what did you, in your own mind, consider that order to Greta was for. Did you think it was to ensure your promotion or as a punishment?— Mr. [[Sadleir|Sadleir]] told me that he was going to get me advanced, and that by not going there I should lose all.
<span id="rc8374">[[#rc8374|8374]]</span> You got that notice?— He told me that repeatedly.
<span id="rc8375">[[#rc8375|8375]]</span> At what time?— I think it was in the stable one morning.
<span id="rc8376">[[#rc8376|8376]]</span> When?— Before I put that application in.
<span id="rc8377">[[#rc8377|8377]]</span> Are you advanced or put back in the service?— I am neither. I am in the same position.
<span id="rc8378">[[#rc8378|8378]]</span> You are a constable in charge of a district in the west?— At Terang.
<span id="rc8379">[[#rc8379|8379]]</span> Then you have not received any promotion for your service?— I have not.
<span id="rc8380">[[#rc8380|8380]]</span> In any way?— In any way.
<span id="rc8381">[[#rc8381|8381]]</span> And it would depend upon the officer recommending you there?— Yes, I think it would depend upon the officer.
<span id="rc8382">[[#rc8382|8382]]</span> You are in Mr. Chambers’s district now, are you?— Yes.
<span id="rc8383">[[#rc8383|8383]]</span> In order to ensure your promotion when you change your district, have you to make way, as it is called, make your character known to the new officer?— I suppose he will go by the record sheet.
<span id="rc8384">[[#rc8384|8384]]</span> Have you not, in going to a fresh district, to prove by your conduct that you are worthy?— You have.
<span id="rc8385">[[#rc8385|8385]]</span> And that puts a man back in the service?— No doubt.
<span id="rc8386">[[#rc8386|8386]]</span> Then with regard to changes, if a man is stationed in the country and he applies for a change, is it considered promotion or the reverse if he is sent down to the depot here?— If he applies for a change it would be at his own request he was sent down.
<span id="rc8387">[[#rc8387|8387]]</span> Supposing it is not at his own request he is transferred from the district, is it considered an advantageous station or the reverse to be sent from a country district down to the barracks?— They consider it a punishment, so I found.
<span id="rc8388">[[#rc8388|8388]]</span> Is that so looked upon in the service?— Yes.
<span id="rc8389">[[#rc8389|8389]]</span> It is not at all events a sign of promotion?— No.....
=== Previous page / Next page ===
<br />
{{MicroficheCopy}}<br />
'''The [[Royal Commission report day 21 page 1|previous day]] / [[Royal Commission report day 23 page 1|next day]] . . . Royal Commission [[Royal Commission Index|index]]'''
[[Category:Royal Commission]] [[Category:October 1518]] [[Category:Royal Commission]] [[Category:Commisioner Standish]] [[Category:history]]
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{{^|Original page location \documents\RoyalCommission\RC810518_22_16_8363.html}}
