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Story of the KellyGang - the Royal Commission evidence
[[Royal Commission report day 16 page 13|previous page]] / [[Royal Commission report day 16 page 15|next page]]
== The Royal Commission evidence for 5/5/1881 ==
''''''
=== full text ===
(see also introduction to [[Royal Commission report 5/5/1881|day 16]])
'''[[Jacob Wilson|Jacob Wilson]] '''giving evidence''''''
<span id="rc4572">[[#rc4572|4572]]</span> How many sons have you?— Three.
<span id="rc4573">[[#rc4573|4573]]</span> What ages are there?— One is 21 years, another is 20, and the other is 18.
<span id="rc4574">[[#rc4574|4574]]</span> What were you doing before that, were you all living on the 50 acres?— No, my eldest son had rented a little farm from a man named [[Jacob Wilson|Cass]], at Glenrowan.
<span id="rc4575">[[#rc4575|4575]]</span> Has he gone from his farm?— Yes, after Ned Kelly was captured there were some of the outlaws' friends round his place every night for about a month, and he had to call the attention of his neighbors to look out and help him to watch at night. He went to Glenrowan to the constable in charge there, and informed him of what had happened, but the constable said it was as much as they could do to look after themselves; there were only four constables in Glenrowan, and they could not look after him.
<span id="rc4576">[[#rc4576|4576]]</span> You know [[Tom Lloyd Jnr|Tom Lloyd's]] house?— Yes.
<span id="rc4577">[[#rc4577|4577]]</span> Supposing you had seen the Kellys there in the evening at eight o'clock, and you had gone into Benalla and given information to Mr. Sadleir that they were there or in Patterson's paddock, would there have been any difficulty in the police getting there?— No, no difficulty if they were ready to go.
<span id="rc4578">[[#rc4578|4578]]</span> How many miles is it from Benalla?— About twelve miles.
<span id="rc4579">[[#rc4579|4579]]</span> Would there be any difficulty in finding Tom Lloyd's house at paddock if they got out at Lurg?— No.
<span id="rc4580">[[#rc4580|4580]]</span> What is the road from Benalla to Tom Lloyd's?— You go to [[Kilfera|Kilfera]] station—the Kilfera road they call it.
<span id="rc4581">[[#rc4581|4581]]</span> Up the main road?— Yes, the main surveyed road to [[Greta|Greta]], and there is a cleared road up to within five miles of Tom Lloyd's house.
<span id="rc4582">[[#rc4582|4582]]</span> Is it clear at his house?— No, a bush track the last five miles.
<span id="rc4583">[[#rc4583|4583]]</span> Did you give any information to Mr. Hare, the time he sent out the man to stop at your house, that you had sees the Kellys about there?— I had a conversation with him.
<span id="rc4584">[[#rc4584|4584]]</span> That you had seen them previous to the man being sent out?— No; I saw Ned Kelly about a month or two after he murdered the police, but I never gave information, for the reason that everything was in the paper next morning, and I would not run the risk.
<span id="rc4585">[[#rc4585|4585]]</span> You are asked did you tell Mr. Hare that you had either seen the Kellys or were sure they were constantly about there?— I said to Mr. Sadleir and Mr. Nicolson, when I was in conversation, that I was perfectly sure they were at Lloyd's house on occasions.
<span id="rc4586">[[#rc4586|4586]]</span> Occasionally?— Often.
<span id="rc4587">[[#rc4587|4587]]</span> Could a party of police have gone out to that camp, to examine it, without you knowing it?— Yes, they may have been there without me seeing it.
<span id="rc4588">[[#rc4588|4588]]</span> Are we to understand that you left that district after the capture of the Kellys from personal fear?— Yes.
<span id="rc4589">[[#rc4589|4589]]</span> That you were afraid to remain in that district in consequence of it being known to the Kelly sympathizers that you were in communication with the police?— Yes.
<span id="rc4590">[[#rc4590|4590]]</span> And had afforded shelter to one of the police to give information?— Yes.
<span id="rc4591">[[#rc4591|4591]]</span> And that also applies to the case of your sons?— Yes.
<span id="rc4592">[[#rc4592|4592]]</span> And in consequence that your selection of 55 acres and improvements were sold to a party you owed £17 to?— Yes.
<span id="rc4593">[[#rc4593|4593]]</span> And that you have not received anything out of that?— Yes.
<span id="rc4594">[[#rc4594|4594]]</span> Why was [[Stephens|Stephens]] sent to your house?— He was a detective, on the information I gave to [[Hare|Mr. Hare]], suggesting that Stephens be sent to my place to watch Tom Lloyd's place, and find out when the Kellys came there.
<span id="rc4595">[[#rc4595|4595]]</span> And you had told Mr. Hare, previous to that, that they were in the habit of coming there?— Yes.
<span id="rc4596">[[#rc4596|4596]]</span> Had you seen them there before?— I had not seen them.
<span id="rc4597">[[#rc4597|4597]]</span> After the time you got up the cherry-tree, had you seen them?— No, I saw them before I got up the cherry-tree; I saw at one time thirteen horses tied up near Tom Lloyd's place.
<span id="rc4598">[[#rc4598|4598]]</span> How long before Stephens was sent to your place, that you saw a number of horses there?— In March, and then we found the hobbles, but I did not give information at once.
<span id="rc4599">[[#rc4599|4599]]</span> Had you seen any unusual gathering of horses between the time of the cherry-tree and the time of the conversation with Mr. Hare?— No.
<span id="rc4600">[[#rc4600|4600]]</span> Is there a well-beaten track from the Lloyds' to the Kellys' house?— Yes; Mrs. Lloyd used to run there with her buggy.
<span id="rc4601">[[#rc4601|4601]]</span> Is [[Kelly Home|Kelly's house]] on the main road?— Yes, on the old Sydney road.
<span id="rc4602">[[#rc4602|4602]]</span> The road from Greta to [[Glenrowan|Glenrowan]]?— Yes, the main road from [[Winton|Winton's]] to Greta, there is no main road to Glenrowan—you have to cross the bush to Glenrowan there.
<span id="rc4603">[[#rc4603|4603]]</span> Kelly's house is on that track?— Yes.
<span id="rc4604">[[#rc4604|4604]]</span> What was the policeman doing while he was at your place?— At the time the Kellys were captured and the time I left the district, the police were twice at my place.
<span id="rc4605">[[#rc4605|4605]]</span> No, I mean Stephens, the man who was at your place did he go out often to look at Lloyd's place?— Yes.....
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[[Royal Commission report day 16 page 13|previous page]] / [[Royal Commission report day 16 page 15|next page]]
== The Royal Commission evidence for 5/5/1881 ==
''''''
=== full text ===
(see also introduction to [[Royal Commission report 5/5/1881|day 16]])
'''[[Jacob Wilson|Jacob Wilson]] '''giving evidence''''''
<span id="rc4572">[[#rc4572|4572]]</span> How many sons have you?— Three.
<span id="rc4573">[[#rc4573|4573]]</span> What ages are there?— One is 21 years, another is 20, and the other is 18.
<span id="rc4574">[[#rc4574|4574]]</span> What were you doing before that, were you all living on the 50 acres?— No, my eldest son had rented a little farm from a man named [[Jacob Wilson|Cass]], at Glenrowan.
<span id="rc4575">[[#rc4575|4575]]</span> Has he gone from his farm?— Yes, after Ned Kelly was captured there were some of the outlaws' friends round his place every night for about a month, and he had to call the attention of his neighbors to look out and help him to watch at night. He went to Glenrowan to the constable in charge there, and informed him of what had happened, but the constable said it was as much as they could do to look after themselves; there were only four constables in Glenrowan, and they could not look after him.
<span id="rc4576">[[#rc4576|4576]]</span> You know [[Tom Lloyd Jnr|Tom Lloyd's]] house?— Yes.
<span id="rc4577">[[#rc4577|4577]]</span> Supposing you had seen the Kellys there in the evening at eight o'clock, and you had gone into Benalla and given information to Mr. Sadleir that they were there or in Patterson's paddock, would there have been any difficulty in the police getting there?— No, no difficulty if they were ready to go.
<span id="rc4578">[[#rc4578|4578]]</span> How many miles is it from Benalla?— About twelve miles.
<span id="rc4579">[[#rc4579|4579]]</span> Would there be any difficulty in finding Tom Lloyd's house at paddock if they got out at Lurg?— No.
<span id="rc4580">[[#rc4580|4580]]</span> What is the road from Benalla to Tom Lloyd's?— You go to [[Kilfera|Kilfera]] station—the Kilfera road they call it.
<span id="rc4581">[[#rc4581|4581]]</span> Up the main road?— Yes, the main surveyed road to [[Greta|Greta]], and there is a cleared road up to within five miles of Tom Lloyd's house.
<span id="rc4582">[[#rc4582|4582]]</span> Is it clear at his house?— No, a bush track the last five miles.
<span id="rc4583">[[#rc4583|4583]]</span> Did you give any information to Mr. Hare, the time he sent out the man to stop at your house, that you had sees the Kellys about there?— I had a conversation with him.
<span id="rc4584">[[#rc4584|4584]]</span> That you had seen them previous to the man being sent out?— No; I saw Ned Kelly about a month or two after he murdered the police, but I never gave information, for the reason that everything was in the paper next morning, and I would not run the risk.
<span id="rc4585">[[#rc4585|4585]]</span> You are asked did you tell Mr. Hare that you had either seen the Kellys or were sure they were constantly about there?— I said to Mr. Sadleir and Mr. Nicolson, when I was in conversation, that I was perfectly sure they were at Lloyd's house on occasions.
<span id="rc4586">[[#rc4586|4586]]</span> Occasionally?— Often.
<span id="rc4587">[[#rc4587|4587]]</span> Could a party of police have gone out to that camp, to examine it, without you knowing it?— Yes, they may have been there without me seeing it.
<span id="rc4588">[[#rc4588|4588]]</span> Are we to understand that you left that district after the capture of the Kellys from personal fear?— Yes.
<span id="rc4589">[[#rc4589|4589]]</span> That you were afraid to remain in that district in consequence of it being known to the Kelly sympathizers that you were in communication with the police?— Yes.
<span id="rc4590">[[#rc4590|4590]]</span> And had afforded shelter to one of the police to give information?— Yes.
<span id="rc4591">[[#rc4591|4591]]</span> And that also applies to the case of your sons?— Yes.
<span id="rc4592">[[#rc4592|4592]]</span> And in consequence that your selection of 55 acres and improvements were sold to a party you owed £17 to?— Yes.
<span id="rc4593">[[#rc4593|4593]]</span> And that you have not received anything out of that?— Yes.
<span id="rc4594">[[#rc4594|4594]]</span> Why was [[Stephens|Stephens]] sent to your house?— He was a detective, on the information I gave to [[Hare|Mr. Hare]], suggesting that Stephens be sent to my place to watch Tom Lloyd's place, and find out when the Kellys came there.
<span id="rc4595">[[#rc4595|4595]]</span> And you had told Mr. Hare, previous to that, that they were in the habit of coming there?— Yes.
<span id="rc4596">[[#rc4596|4596]]</span> Had you seen them there before?— I had not seen them.
<span id="rc4597">[[#rc4597|4597]]</span> After the time you got up the cherry-tree, had you seen them?— No, I saw them before I got up the cherry-tree; I saw at one time thirteen horses tied up near Tom Lloyd's place.
<span id="rc4598">[[#rc4598|4598]]</span> How long before Stephens was sent to your place, that you saw a number of horses there?— In March, and then we found the hobbles, but I did not give information at once.
<span id="rc4599">[[#rc4599|4599]]</span> Had you seen any unusual gathering of horses between the time of the cherry-tree and the time of the conversation with Mr. Hare?— No.
<span id="rc4600">[[#rc4600|4600]]</span> Is there a well-beaten track from the Lloyds' to the Kellys' house?— Yes; Mrs. Lloyd used to run there with her buggy.
<span id="rc4601">[[#rc4601|4601]]</span> Is [[Kelly Home|Kelly's house]] on the main road?— Yes, on the old Sydney road.
<span id="rc4602">[[#rc4602|4602]]</span> The road from Greta to [[Glenrowan|Glenrowan]]?— Yes, the main road from [[Winton|Winton's]] to Greta, there is no main road to Glenrowan—you have to cross the bush to Glenrowan there.
<span id="rc4603">[[#rc4603|4603]]</span> Kelly's house is on that track?— Yes.
<span id="rc4604">[[#rc4604|4604]]</span> What was the policeman doing while he was at your place?— At the time the Kellys were captured and the time I left the district, the police were twice at my place.
<span id="rc4605">[[#rc4605|4605]]</span> No, I mean Stephens, the man who was at your place did he go out often to look at Lloyd's place?— Yes.....
=== Previous page / Next page ===
<br />
{{MicroficheCopy}}<br />
'''The [[Royal Commission report day 15 page 1|previous day]] / [[Royal Commission report day 17 page 1|next day]] . . . Royal Commission [[Royal Commission Index|index]]'''
[[Category:Royal Commission]] [[Category:April 1505]] [[Category:Royal Commission]] [[Category:Commisioner Standish]] [[Category:history]]
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{{^|Original page location \documents\RoyalCommission\RC810505_16_14_4572.html}}
