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The Royal Commission evidence for 12/4/1881

(see also introduction to day 11)

[[../../people/peU_Z/wyattMag.htm|'Alfred Wyatt, P.M. giving evidence']]

2231 You brought us to the time you got out the horses at Euroa?— While they were getting those horses out, Detective Ward came to me and said something to me of a guarded nature, the exact words of which I cannot now remember, but, after some remarks, he asked me the question whether I thought it would be judicious of him to start immediately they got on the tracks, or to wait for Superintendent Nicolson. That question, put to me by Detective Ward, was the first intimation to me that Mr. Nicolson knew of our being there, and could at all be on the spot. In that manner I was struck with the development of the same impression that had arisen in my mind on the way down: that there might be some conflict between the two heads of the expedition—Ward and Johnson. At that time I did not know which was the superior authority under whose charge it might be; I thought under Ward's charge, but I did not know; but I did know that frequently between the detective service and the other active service there is sometimes a little jealousy as to control. After reflecting, I said words of this sort to Ward— “Well, it depends upon how soon you expect Mr. Nicolson down.” He said to me— “Oh, he is coming down; he has had a telegram and he is on the way down.” And I said— “Well, it depends upon how many hours he will delay your going in pursuit.” Ward said— “Well, I cannot tell how many hours.” Then I said— “I must put it thus: if he will delay you only a few hours, say two, or perhaps only three, I think you would be wise to stay for these reasons, viz., three of these men (meaning the Kellys) are upon grass-fed horses”—I had learned that from the people of the station— “and only one of them is shod; on the other hand, your horses are all corn-fed and in fine stable condition, and they are all shod, and, in a twelve or twenty-four hours' pursuit, I do not think it signifies much, if you get well on the tracks, if you are two or three hours behind, compared with having your superior officer with you.” Also looking to what I felt, fearing there might be jars between the two men.

2232 At what time did you get back to Euroa?— I can give you the means of finding it; it was before daylight, because my object was, and I remember feeling very pleased indeed that I had got down before daylight, while it was only a hazy moon, so that the men would be able to get on the tracks the moment they could see them. I remember it was before daylight from that. I think we stayed at Faithfull's Creek station about twenty-five minutes or half-an-hour. I do not think more than ten or twelve minutes in running from Faithfull's Creek to Euroa.

2233 Then you would be there at three in the morning?— That is just about where we were, I think, and I imagine that is when it began daylight. That is the advice I gave Ward, and feeling it was rather grave advice to give, I then said— “Whatever you resolve, I will now go back by this train to Benalla, wait there for Mr. Nicolson, come back with him in our special, and possess him of all the information that I have to enable him to get straight on to the horse that you must have waiting at the fence of the Faithfull's Creek station and join in the pursuit the moment he comes down.” My impression was we should have him there between five and six.

2234 You stated when you got to Faithfull's Creek you took depositions which did not occupy more than half-an-hour. In those depositions did you take down in writing, or were you told how long prior to that the Kellys had gone?— Yes, I was told that, but I forget now; those depositions are in Captain Standish's department.

2235 How many hours before you got there were the Kellys gone?— My impression is that I was told what harmonized with what was in the papers after that, that they left about seven or eight o'clock, but my impression is not clear.

2236 That would be four or five hours?— From seven or eight o'clock to twelve o'clock , and on to three o'clock . Having given that advice, I started back, I believe, immediately by the special train to Benalla. At Benalla I found, in some way I now cannot remember, I suppose from some enquiry at the station, the telegraph office, that Mr. Nicolson would not be down as soon as I expected. I found I would have an hour or an hour and a half to go back to my hotel and lie down or do anything I could. I did that, and came back in good early time before the train arrived.

2237 What train?— With Mr. Nicolson, and I believe, but cannot now remember certainly, that Mr. Nicolson went back into Benalla proper for some time. Either then or on the subsequent journey down with him from Benalla to Euroa I told him all I knew. We went together in the second special train. Oh, I find—[looking at a diary]—that Mr. Nicolson arrived from-Wodonga at Benalla at 6.30. I started with him after some delay, but we were again detained at Violet Town . That reminds me that the enquiries made made me understand that the delay at Violet Town was owing something due to the block system that we could not get the line between Violet Town and Euroa. We had to wait a very exasperatingly long time—I am not sure an hour. The result was we did not get down to Euroa till nine o'clock , though we started at 6.30. When we arrived we found the black trackers had run the track back towards Strathbogie for a mile and a half, then round westward.

2238 What track?— The Kelly tracks, from Faithfull's Creek station backwards into the Strathbogie for a mile and a half, then round westward and southward and back to the line where it was lost, and was being searched for when we arrived.

2239 Whom did you see when you arrived?— When we arrived, the first thing I noticed standing at the side of the railway was a black man, who, I suppose, was a black tracker; and I remember thinking to myself, “How did that man come—did he come with us or since?”

2240 You said when you arrived at nine o'clock they had run the tracks?— The one who told me was, I think, Mr. McCauley, the station manager.

2241 Had the police gone out?— Yes.

2242 They had come back at nine?— Yes, a black tracker with the police party.

2243 They did not await the arrival of the superintendent?— No, they had made that preliminary expedition; they had gone up to Faithfull's Creek and had picked up the track there. The police party, with the black tracker, had gone from Euroa back to Faithfull's Creek and had picked up the track and run it in the manner I have described. They were found to be at fault near the railway station, and were searching for the lost track again when we arrived again, so that no time was really lost.

2244 Was Constable Johnson at the railway station when you arrived?— I do not think I saw any of the police there......

The witness withdrew.

Adjourned to tomorrow at eleven o'clock .

[~[[See report of Proceedings 12/4/81]|5865]~]

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13/4/1881

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